tv Bloomberg Markets Bloomberg February 25, 2021 1:00pm-2:00pm EST
welcome to bloomberg commodities edge where we focus on companies, the physical assets and trading behind the hottest commodities with the smartest voices in the business. we are going to take a look at the top market stories of the week. first up, boil inventory. we are starting to see the beginning of the fallout from texas, stockpiles of crude increasing overall. particularly 1.2 9 billion barrels on the back of a build in the midwest. demand was also hit, refinery runs felt -- at the slowest level since 2008. what we also learned is the demand got an enormous hit when it comes -- to gasoline. diesel also saying that you can see how it rolled over signifying what we saw in texas. those pockets of pain can be felt all over the global energy market. here is one way to look at it. that basically turns into petrochemicals, used to make
everything from medical masks to car interiors. typically sent to asia. we are looking at missing pricing. the first month, more expensive than the second month. that is all because of the demand and the supply not matching up because of texas. this matters how long that will last. let's get into the ring. the big conversation this week was also, are we in a commodity super cycle? commodity markets no doubt, yes. they are booming. oil up by 30%. copper hitting a nine year high. grain markets experiencing shortages. supply production responses. how big is it going to be? let's ask eddie van der walt who covers commodities. do you buy the commodity super cycle story? are we in one? eddie: i think so. there are two elements to what you mentioned. on the one hand, there is a demand boom that has come back on the back of covid and people are getting excited about the summer. at the same time, commodities are harder to transport as a result of the covid restrictions.
i think the supply-side is being hit. i think the super cycle element is part of that. particularly, that is all about ev's and our shift away from the oil economy to what is really going to be the age of copper. and i think that is just something that we are not set up for. electric vehicles are arriving quicker than people had expected. alix: the age of copper, that's it. that's the thing. a ceo was talking to us about the supply dynamic. this is what he was talking about. >> supply and demand is pretty well-balanced. but if you look at 3%, looking forward, and the ability of the industry to deliver into that demand, particularly if the electrification technologies are driven as high as we think they will be, i think the world will struggle to fill that demand. alix: what mark was talking
about, why won't supply pickup? while out there be an a more -- a more immediate supply response? eddie: that is why i call this the asia copper and not the age of lithium. in order to deliver that electricity, you need loads of copper to get it to your car, in for your car to use more copper. to your question about why? supply is not going to pick up. for commodities like lithium, newly finding useful, there are loads of resources out there that we have not discovered and not have tapped. copper, we have been using since the roman age. so really, we have discovered all of the big resources that we are going to find. there is no big grassroots that we will discover tomorrow. that's the problem. we have been using this stuff for a long time. supply can pick up so much. but it cannot keep up with the growth and demand that we are going to see. alix: that is such a great
point. as of now, relatively new, what we see in the bond market. eddie van der walt. time for commodity in chief where we talk to one executive in the commodity world. today it is david towell, ceo of centaurs energy. let's dig into the potential for the next big play for global shale. argentina. it is the one place outside the u.s. where shale drilling could take off. in particular, in patagonia. experts have been saying this for almost a decade. will 2021 be the year? in december, oil production reached a record high of 124,000 barrels of oil a day. that number could hit 150 by the end of the year. the potential. the rocks are thicker, more oil is trapped, higher pressure so you can get more oil out, and it is underdeveloped. there are a ton of players in the market. you have big oil like shale, it quinn north, chevron. you've got big local players,
especially white, majority owned by the government. and made up 95% of shale oil production four years ago. one small local player which delivered record production in december, 15,000 barrels of oil a day. the main problem, argentina itself. you've got infrastructure bottlenecks, export and import come -- controls, and subsidies has made access to capital markets hard to impossible. the world will always need oil. even as it tries to move away from it. will the world needed from argentina? enter sentara's energy. it has properties in multiple properties in argentina with conventional protection and oil-producing shale assets. the company recently merged with crown point energy. a junior oil and gas company producing conventional oil in argentina and holding other exploration blocks. i recently sat down with the newly minted ceo and asked him about the capital flows going
into the region. david: we know the russians have been looking for quite some time, the chinese have been looking for quite some time. and i expect that they will go ahead and take advantage of a market where a lot of developed countries are environmentally focused and will pull back. alix: and i take a look at why and the government is not releasing enough dollars for them to pay back short-term bonds. they went ahead and restructured the whole curve. when you have something like that psychologically, how do investors get over that? david: they do. alix: they just do. david: the investors have gotten over it with respect to argentina a number of times. and i think investors will also get over it with respect to yupf. --ypf. you are not dealing with green investors when it comes to investing in the debt of argentina or the debt of the provinces or the debt of ypf. they all know how the game
gets played. alix: how much capital needs to come in a year? david: five to 10 billion. to maximize it. alix: that is a lot, no? david: it is. it is. i think if the government were to be thoughtful about it, and the question is if they can be thoughtful about it, but if they were to be thoughtful about it, i think they can set up the right incentives to allow for that kind of investment. alix: what is the incentive? i'm -- i'm assuming no export caps. but walk me through realistically what the government would need to do, and what they actually would do. david: they would have to give up some in the short-term in order to gain a lot in the long term. so the taxes are quite high. and when i say taxes, i mean that broadly. not only direct corporate taxes
but royalty payments that need to be paid to the provinces coupled with the fact that the provincial entities also own a piece of every oil and gas concession in the country. so there is a lot there. labor is pretty strong. i don't expect that that labor will get any weaker. however, there needs to be an understanding that if you let more money coming, there will be more jobs for people. therefore, net, you will get ahead. in addition, equipment needs to really come into the country without these import tariffs on that equipment. you need a pretty sophisticated equipment in order to go ahead and produce properly. alix: at what point is this going to be too late? i know you see higher oil prices but more money will go to renewables and greening the energy structure. 23rd, 2040? at what point is it like, we can't do it? david: if they don't get their act together in the next 10 years, it will become a hard sell. i do expect in the developed world, we will reach peak consumption of oil in 10 years. so therefore, after that, unless
we get massive goons in emerging markets and -- in undeveloped countries which is possible, which will make up for the consumption that it is now waning in developed countries, everyone will see the oil business for what it is. alix: that was my interview with david tawil, ceo of centaurus. i want to look at some of the companies being hit by the energy crisis and now they are faring as are starting to come out. pioneer, both oil producers, are losing 2% of their production. just energy, looking at a $350 million loss. exelon sees a hit to net income in the first quarter at 710 million dollars after its plants were forced to shut down. this is just the beginning. lots more numbers will come out over the next few weeks. here is what is on my radar for next week. it will not be in houston, but it will be virtual. where we get to hear from all
the major oil companies and players all over the world. march 3 is exxon's day. they took it out of their reserve portfolio. we will talk about that next week. that does it for bloomberg's "commodities edge." you can catch as each thursday at 1:00 p.m. eastern time. this is bloomberg. ♪ [ sigh ] not gonna happen. that's it. i'm calling kohler about their walk-in bath. my name is ken. how may i help you? hi, i'm calling about kohler's walk-in bath. excellent! happy to help. huh? hold one moment please... [ finger snaps ] hmm. ♪ ♪ the kohler walk-in bath features an extra-wide opening and a low step-in at three inches, which is 25 to 60% lower than some leading competitors. the bath fills and drains quickly, while the heated seat soothes your back, neck and shoulders.
kohler is an expert in bathing, so you can count on a deep soaking experience. are you seeing this? the kohler walk-in bath comes with fully adjustable hydrotherapy jets and our exclusive bubblemassage. everything is installed in as little as a day by a kohler-certified installer. and it's made by kohler- america's leading plumbing brand. we need this bath. yes. yes you do. a kohler walk-in bath provides independence with peace of mind. call... to receive fifty percent off installation. and take advantage of our special offer of no payments for eighteen months.
>> i'm matt miller. welcome to "bloomberg markets." we have an absolutely stellar lineup for you. mark gandhi, the ceo of colony capital, will be with us in just a moment. he runs tom barrack's firm and raised over $4 billion for a second fund focused on digital infrastructure. then zillow is no longer an online platform for creeping on the value of your neighbors house. we will talk to stan humphrey, the company's chief analytics officer about how it will flip houses on its own. an arc investment management mirror kathy wood says bitcoin has trillions of market cap potential we will have the latest from bloomberg crypto summit. let's take a look at what is going on in markets. of throughout the global macro movers street -- screen to illustrate the huge moves in bonds. you can see bonds are the middle column here and anything -- when a box has a black box inside of
it, that means the move is more than three standard deviations away from the 30 day z-score from the norm. u.s. five years are up 21 basis points. and everywhere really, you can see that rates are rising. the squares are read because the price is down. bonds are getting sold off. the rates are going through the roof. take a look at some of these prices we are dealing with in today's market. the 10 year right now is trading at more than a yield of more than 1.46 -- actually, 1.52. it has gone up in the short break between alix's show. that is amazing. that 10 year yield has rallied 32 basis points in the last eight trading days alone. the nasdaq getting hit hard by rising rates. down 2.8%.
the euro interestingly enough continues to rise. gone over 122. you expect rates like this to draw your own investors into u.s. treasuries and out of the common currency. that is not happening at the rate you would expect. gamestop, almost doubling the price at yesterday's clothes when it's -- when it doubled the price at the close the day before that. a lot going on. this is part of what has caught my eye today. one of the most interesting stories out there. deutsche bank analysts have said we could see $170 billion of cash unleashed by retail investors into the market. basically, $465 billion could go to direct a stimulus. deutsche bank survey to potential recipients. they said they put 37% of that stimulus straight into the stock market. that could be a huge windfall
for stocks, definitely something you want to keep your eye on, especially as the volume has just exploded. we've got a chart showing 1090. showing how high the volume has gone in the markets. it has just jumped way over what we saw happen on the vix. something that you want to keep your eye on as well. let's get more insight on what is happening in retail trading in today's selloff from our markets reporter, pretty cooped up. talk to us first about the relationship between rates and the stock market. every stock is headed down big time as these rates are exploding. kriti: it is the idea about the trading tantrum pair that is dragon the market down. that is also in tandem with the bond you are seeing selloff. you pointed out, you are seeing a global bloodbath when it comes to fixed income. really tells you growth stocks
in general don't do well when yields rise the way they are rising. the margin of the moussa something that is really move -- worth paying attention to. that is what is tipping off the tech stock. that is what has been rallying. that part pulling back because of risk sentiment that has been a little bit turned off off the gamestop saga. a lot going on. but i would say yields and gamestop. that is today's market story. matt: what is the story with gamestop? what is the big boost? yesterday we saw a giant jump. today again. even as the rest of the stock market drops. why? kriti: absolutely. i want to make a little bit of a historical thing. the last time we saw gamestop a royal the markets, it had a lot to do with investor confidence. so you saw as soon as gamestop surged the way it is surging today, you saw the broader market step back. . this has only happened one week in history as far as 2021 goes.
today, that seems to be the correlation that is sticking around. gamestop surges, the reddit short stocks surged, the rest of the market pulls back. that being said, you are also seeing those shorted stock, driven by the retail frenzy. a big question is who is actually driving this? it is no longer the institutional investors hopping in on the big momentum trade. this is all retail. they are messing with the market in a big way. matt: thank you very much. kriti gupta, talking about the market action today. there is a lot of action to talk about. colony capital shifts to digital. we are going to discuss how the firm is transitioning away from traditional real estate with the ceo next. the infrastructure spending at this country or that country macy could be gigantic. and most of the smart money is talking digital improvements. marc ganzi, the ceo of colony, is betting on that with a $4 billion fund. we will talk to him next.
this is bloomberg. ♪ so you're a small business, or a big one. you were thriving, but then... oh. ah. okay. plan, pivot. how do you bounce back? you don't, you bounce forward, with serious and reliable internet. powered by the largest gig speed network in america. but is it secure? sure it's secure. and even if the power goes down, your connection doesn't. so how do i do this? you don't do this. we do this, together. bounce forward, with comcast business.
matt: this is "bloomberg markets." i'm matt miller. we are seeing a wild ride in rates today. and that is really the tail that is wagging the dog. the 10 year yield has eclipsed 150. you are looking at the bottom of your screen, 151.13 on the tenure. less than two weeks ago, it was trading for 120. so a huge jump in yields. the absolute number is not too high but it is the speed of the move that matters and that is why you are seeing the selloff in equity indexes. the dow down, down more than 400 points. the nasdaq down 2.5%. we will continue to cover these big moves in markets for you. i want to get to a really exciting interview. colony capital, reported fourth-quarter results today
announced progress in its digital rotation. with digital colony second fund raising for $2 billion so far of its $6 billion target. joining us is the ceo of colony, marc ganzi who took over the helm as chief executive last july. let me first ask you about the impetus for this fund. we are just starting now to hear pieces of biden's possible infrastructure plan. and a lot of the focus is on digital. what led you to position ahead of the game? marc: i think that the mannix today -- and thank you for having me on today. but that the mattix that we are looking at in our second fund are really exciting. if you think about the spend around five g networks, you think about the applications of iot networks growing from literally a billion devices to 20 billion devices, you thing about cloud infrastructure spend, that enabling cloud computing, and as we look
around the corner to edge computing and how we make all of this technology enabled, 10% of the cloud workloads are going to be out in the periphery networks to places that are secondary cities, tertiary cities, and as you and i have discussed, some of these places don't have a broad brand infrastructures. it is incredibly timely. these are the big things we are pursuing in our second fund. matt: in a way, it is almost an esd play as well. the inclusion that can be achieved in widening digital networks is really in the interest of governments and society. marc: it is. we talk a lot about the social and locations of what we do today at colony capital and the privilege we have to to build this infrastructure. and also we have -- we have this responsibility to the planet. today on my earnings call, we not -- we announced an initiative. two of our companies out of the 19 digital businesses are
already carbon neutral. carbon zero. many of the companies are purchasing green power. got to build this infrastructure with a thought about the future in mind. there are social and locations, and bar mental applications, we have made big transformations to our governance and our boards. also the way we are recruiting and bringing talent into colony capital has totally changed. this is really a holistic approach to esg. matt: a lot of governments are using the slogan "build back better." what is your expectation in terms of infrastructure spending from, for example, just the united states government? marc: i think our little piece of the ecosystem is probably somewhere in the order of magnitude in the u.s. of about 240 billion dollars spent in terms of new digital infrastructure. a big chunk of that will be fiber-optic cabling. there is about $100 billion associated to that. half of that will be some of the
cloud. there is a $1.1 trillion spend to build 5g over the next eight years. all of this in the aggregate adds up. it is a pretty exciting total address of market for us and our shareholders. we are excited. we know we have to get to work. we know there are a lot of things to do. governments will have a hand. in the work that i have done with the sec, working for former chairman pie and now working with the kermit -- the current chairman, it is important that we continue to facilitate broadband and digital infrastructure. we've got to have a clear path to building this infrastructure. where government can help us out is clearing spectrum faster. making sure there is less paperwork. this is how we take america forward. this is how we build better. matt: we've got about 30 seconds per and how difficult is it to raise financing if such a volatile market? marc: we are in a privileged asset class right now. have been very fortunate. digital infrastructure has been one of the safe havens in the pandemic. sometimes we feel a little
ashamed to say this, but i had my best year in business i've ever had in my 27 years of building digital infrastructure. all 19 of our portfolio companies grew last year. why? if you think about the shift to where we maintain our lives and how we are disk -- conducting this interview, everything revolves around that mission-critical plumbing to make all of this work. and that is digital infrastructure. the last nine months i have been crisscrossing it -- crisscrossing the planet via zoom and teams. investors are excited. we at colony capital, with our singular focus, we offer that opportunity to invest in it. matt: thank you for your time. really appreciate it. marc ganzi, colony capital ceo talking about a digital infrastructure fund now worth more than $4.2 billion. ♪
acting chief of the u.s. capitol police took exception to the characterization that the department was unprepared for the deadly riot on january 6. >> the department was not ignorant of intelligence indicating an attack of the size and scale we encountered on the six. there was no such intelligence. although we knew the likelihood for violence by extremists, no credible threat indicated that tens of thousands would attack the u.s. capitol. mark: chief pittman noted former chief seat -- steven sund's advance request for help was turned down by paul irving, which irving has denied. the manhattan district attorney's office obtained former president trump's tax returns. that is according to cnn. the report says the records include millions of pages of documents. the da's office got the go-ahead
to obtain the documents this week, after the u.s. supreme court rejected a bid from mr. trump's accounting firm to block the subpoena. china is dismissing u.s. efforts to shift supply chains toward alternative sources is unrealistic. that came hours after president biden signed an order aimed at ending the u.s. reliance on china and other adversaries. the president directed his staff to address shortfalls in semiconductor production. the shortage at some auto plans. authorities have taken russian opposition leader alexion navalny from his jail. the top ada says neither his family nor his lawyers have been told where he is being taken. president biden air putin's most prominent -- into incarceration for breaking his parole. that was the last obstacle keeping him from being sent to a prison outside the capital. global news, 24 hours a day, on air and on bloomberg quicktake, powered by more than 2700 journalists and analysts in over
120 countries. i'm mark crumpton. this is bloomberg. >> i am amber kanwar in for amanda lane. welcome to "bloomberg markets." matt: welcome to you and we welcome both are bloomberg and bnn bloomberg audiences. i met miller. here are our top stories from the bloomberg terminal. fount -- sounding the alarm for risk assets. yields on u.s. debt sore and a possible warning sign for speculative euphoria. we will discuss what is behind the dramatic move in the market as the 10 year yield rises above 150 pair the highest level in a year. zillow pushes into homebuying.
the real estate giant putting cash behind its estimates and its strategy to embrace home flipping. we will discuss with jeevan analytics offers are -- office area stan humphries. the bloomberg crypto summit is underway. we will bring you the latest from the event as cathie wood says bitcoin has trillions of dollars in market cap potential. amber: all right, that investments that arc has is the poster child for some of the victims we are seeing in the market right now, as a result of that huge move that we are seeing in the bond market. do u.s. 10 year touching 1.5%. the highest level since february 2020. but is having all kinds of ripple effects in the market right now. you can see that in the s&p 500. every single one of those sectors is trading lower. tach is bearing the brunt of that pain. so much of the conversation has been around well, you can afford
these high valuations intact because rates are so low. all, the narrative is being challenged. you are seeing investors take a second, third, perhaps a fourth look at some of the valuations. sector is spared. even financials which typically like the higher rates is down on the day. it is having a broadly dampening effect on the equity markets. as we mentioned, the real moves are what is happening in the bond market. the question is, how did we get here with respect to the selling? you are seeing a lot of fed numbers content to watch this, believing some of it has to do with an improving outlook for the economy. it is also forcing a type of selling in the market. we are learning a lot more about something called convexity hedging. and that is bringing some of that selling pressure to the four. let's bring in chris maloney who focuses on the mortgage market which is very much part of the story. maybe you can flesh out this
concept of how convexity hedging is forcing the selling pressure here today? chris: it is one of the reasons the market is watching the reaction of mortgage bonds investors of great selloff because a primary characteristic of mortgage bonds is that they are always -- homeowners can refinance it at any time into a lower mortgage rate at part. what is happening with the rising interest rates, a lot of american homeowners who previously had incentive to refinance their loan, no longer do. with prepayments speeds running their fastest since 2003, suddenly, from the end of the year, where 80% of the universe had nuts -- had an incentive, now they onlyof t universe to have incentive. either the mortgage bond portfolio manager, you see the future cash flows are pushed out.
your duration is pushed out. which means you need to sell treasuries, which is one way to bring your duration back in line. especially when rates jump i suddenly, you sell the most liquid high-quality assets, and that is usually treasuries. matt: can we step back for a minute? time in the middle of bond markets for dummies. i think i've got duration, convexity is maybe a little bit more complex. is there a way to easily explain convexity iteration? chris: what it basically is, it shows the sensitivity of the bond you hold, the changes in the prevailing interest rate. as cash flows are pushed further into the future, your bond becomes more sensitive to changes in interest rates. so when interest rates are going up, the price of bonds go down. so the higher your duration is, the worst your bond will perform
into higher interest rates. that is what happens with mortgages. matt: and yet, the appetite for duration continues to grow, doesn't it? chris: well, yeah, well right now you want to shed duration if you are a bond portfolio manager. you have a portfolio mortgage bond, and you have to bench it to a certain index, now your duration because nobody is prepaying anymore, has suddenly went from three years to five years. you actually shed duration. one of the ways to do that is to sell treasuries. and that can exacerbate rate moves. amber: one of the big buyers in the mortgage market right now is the fed. they don't actually engage in this kind of hedging strategy. so talk about what their role in the mortgage market looks like in this kind of environment? if it were not for them, would selling pressure be that much worse or do they act as a
backstop? chris: at is an excellent point. that is one of the major differences between now and past convexity episode such as 2003 and 2013. the fed has become one of the dominant players of the market since the era of quantitative easing began back in 2008. they now own about 33% of all mortgages. the fed does not hedge whatsoever. that takes a lot of this threat out of the market. in addition, the banks own 33%. they had infrequently. the government-sponsored, at one time, back into thousand three, they owned 20% of the market. and they were very big hedgers. any rate moves were responded to quickly by the mortgage bond investors by doing this convexity hedging. with the fed and the banks holding two thirds, the threat
is not nearly what it used to be. matt: thanks so much. i'm sure this is a busy day for you. thank you for joining us. bloomberg's chris maloney there on the rates market which is just going absolutely crazy. again, the 10 year yield jumping well above 150. this morning, it was looking like it could be hovering around 140. in one day, we are looking at 10 basis points which is a big move for the bond market. coming up, give me your best estimate. we will speak to zillow chief analytics officers stan humphries. he makes those estimates and he may offer to buy your house soon. this is bloomberg. ♪
matt: this is "bloomberg markets." i'm matt miller alongside amber kanwar. we are looking at an incredible run-up in the 10 year yield. 148 is where it is right now. we've gone as high as 160 today. and as low as 137. that is quite a range. just two weeks ago, we were looking at 120. a big jump in rates. that is the reason you see the big drop in equity indexes. it is basically sell everything day, with investors getting rid of equities, getting rid of bonds. they are selling of gold at 1775, selling off oil at $66 a barrel for brent crude. pretty much everything except the dollar is doing quite well, even the euro is coming back down. a lot of action in this market. we will continue to keep you updated on all of the moves. now, amber, do you use zillow? amber: yeah, i'm pretty much on
all of the apps. i'm in the market. so i'm looking at everything. matt: yeah, i have to agree with you. at least, i'm in the market too, looking for a place around westchester. but i only use zero -- use zillow. it is pretty much the only app i have come to rely on, even when i'm apartment hunting in new york. the interesting thing is zillow is no longer just an app you can use to look for a new house. in fact, zillow might be a company that wants to buy the house you live in right now. zestimatezestimate thes -- the zestimates have become famous. they estimate the value of a house, sometimes for sale, sometimes not. and pretty soon, they will start asking, inviting owners to take them up on what is going to be a cash offer. let's bring in stan humphries, the chief analytics officer at zillow.
if i'm not mistaken, you or your team, you make these zestimates. now you are putting your money where your mouth is. stan: hey, good afternoon here that's exactly right. not just zoom -- soon, but today consumers can -- consumers can go to zillow and look at their zestimate end may be be able to use that as an initial cash offer for us to bow your home. super excited about this. it has been 15 years in the making. we were dreaming we would get to this point where we -- where the valuation would be an initial transaction. we are happy to be here. amber: so talk to me about the inputs. how do you decide what a home is worth, in a market where you are not the realtor, you have not
been doing it for decades, you are using all kinds of digital information. what are the inputs into what is going on to guesstimating what these homes are worth? stan: great question. our valuations, is high-quality data and great algorithms. on the data side, we are taking public record data and imagery, and then we put that into algorithms. essentially the algorithms -- i will not bore you with details. they try to do something that is pretty intuitive. find a set of homes that are similar to the house and make adjustments for small differences between the homes and that is how we produce the valuation. over the 15 years when we started in 2006, our error rates were north of 14%. today they are under, initially 1.9% on market homes. for homes where we have made an offer.
they tried to traditionally sell their homes, those homes are selling for less than 1% difference than our offers we made to those consumers. so we are very accurate on the homes that we are making zillow offers on now. matt: so it is a lot of. 500,000 properties across 20 markets. my initial thought today is watch rates. are you concerned about the direction we see, not only yields, but mortgage rates going right now? isn't this going to cost you a lot? more than it would as of yesterday. stan: well, we do believe that zillow offers is a great business. meaning it is a business working in a both up and down market. and remember, we are using credit facilities to take purchases of those homes, and then we are holding those homes for a limited amount of time. our goal, as a market maker, fix it up and get it back into the
marketplace. we are essentially a liquidity provider. so we don't have -- we do have capital costs, and those do bear relationships to the 10 year yield curve. generally, we are not taking up your mortgages and these homes. amber: all right, liquidity provider but also not a charity. i assume you are looking to make money on these homes you are fixing up and flipping. what is the average rate of return? stan: long term, i would say we think there is a really good business. a really good business both on the return for the home itself, but also as i just mentioned, the fact that we are selling these homes quickly. it means we are using that same cast multiple times a year. we think it looks very attractive. right now, we are mainly trying to grow this business, so we are not focusing on returns right now. we are trying to grow the business. and get in front of consumers
and raise awareness of it. matt: what is your take on the housing market right now? it seems like it is going to tighten up a little this year. stan: the housing market continues to be really a bright spot in the broader economy that continues to see challenges. into the broader economy. the housing market we think by the summer will be growing north at 10%. we think 2021, home rates will rise -- i'm sorry, home prices will rise 10%, and we will see a lot of items. it is just a crazy housing market. it is also where we are seeing a lot of home sales, but inventory is very low. so essentially, the housing market has become a just-in-time manufacturing process. homes hit the market, and 14 days later, they are being sold again. we are selling very fast and there is not very much inventory. amber: stan humphries, fascinating story.
thank you for joining us. chief analytics officer with a zillow. we continue to track the moves in the market. bitcoin is downright pedestrian compared to what we see in the bond market. cathie wood speaking at the crypto come -- crypto summit says to look for crypto to be worth trillions in the future. more on her take when we come back. ♪ ♪
amber: this is "bloomberg markets." i am amber kanwar alongside matt miller. we have been tracking while moves in the market. the bond market as well as what is going on in stocks. the most stable asset of them all appears to be bitcoin. we are not seeing it move much on either side of 50,000. the real blockbuster numbers could potentially be coming from coinbase, the biggest exchange crypto currency exchange in the u.s. filing for a direct listing. a valuation map could be 100
billion dollars worth more than ice, which has the nasdaq and cme. it tells you how big the market potential is. but also how much their valuation has gone up. as the value of cryptocurrencies they trade have gone up. matt: cryptocurrency is up across the board. we focus in on bitcoin, because obviously it is the biggest market cap and a lot of the other crypto's are based off the bitcoin blockchain. there are so many others that we are looking at crypto. it is going to overtake the dow jones industrial average market cap soon. the interesting thing, i think you are right, is just the stability of bitcoin. on a day like today when we are seeing just huge moves in assets that typically are infamous for being stable like 10-year treasuries, we see bitcoin doing a lot of nothing and just hovering around $50,000. so i think -- i don't know if this is a mirage or if this will
change a lot of minds about crypto. amber: we have had a lot of people talking about crypto on the channel. bloomberg hosting its crypto summit. here is a little of what we have heard so far. >> it is coming to the forefront of the conversation with all companies, private and public. >> over 2021, we will see even more corporate participation in the asset class. >> we believe there is 100 trillion dollars total addressable market for digital monetary network. >> when you aggregate all of these ease cases for bitcoin. >> show consumer use cases for this technology. . then they will understand what it is. >> you do get into the trillions of dollars of market cap potential. >> it make sense to buy as much of that asset classes we can. >> the career risk has gone from wide to why not? -- why to why not? amber: let's bring in joel white
-- joe weisenthal. you spoke with michael thaler who has transformed his company into a bitcoin holding company. what were some of your key takeaways from that interview? joe: there's not a bitcoin etf on u.s. markets but it is the closest thing, in the sense that they have bought a lot of bitcoin. shares is that company are really sort of tracking those holdings. they seem to want to acquire more. it is very interesting. he has been very influential. you see more companies do it. tesla is the other one. seen a handful of others. he has this argument which is that it is very risky to hold cash. so ultimately, the best thing to hold as an alternative to that, in his view, a company should hold significant amounts of capital. and working cash. and that bitcoin is an excellent as it to hold. obviously look, bitcoin had an
incredible run. in the end, i think that is a big part of the story. it is an asset that has gone up. matt: you know, the hard part to understand is the use case for bitcoin. and that may sound rich coming from an, but i heard glenn hutchins trying to talk erik schatzker through it. and i get that there are use cases for a lot of other alt coins. but for bitcoin, the transaction is costly, slow, and it does not seem to have picked up any speed. joe: you know what i think the answer is? use cases making more money. and it kind of breaks your head because why those go up. i know. in the end, this is the argument for holding it. you can come up with a lot of fancy stuff about blockchain technology but the advocates of bitcoin basically say to buy it because it will go higher. matt: great talking -- amber: i think a lot of people
still think of it. matt: sorry. amber: go ahead. matt: really a use case as glenn hutchins was telling eric. he wants it to have some other use case beyond just being a store of value. because in his view, it is only a store of value if it has a use case. that is the difficult nut to crack so to speak. a lot of people share joe's view that the use case is kind of the greater fool theory. in any case, thank you for joining us. joe weisenthal there. you can catch him later on on why do you miss at 4:30 p.m. new york time. for amber kanwar and matt miller, this is bloomberg. ♪ s is bloomberg. ♪
in-person learning. officials say city schools have a positive covid-19 test rate of less than 1%. the nation's largest public school system has administered about 500,000 covid-19 tests. and more than 30,000 teachers have been vaccinated. the mayor said today, quote, new york public schools are the safest place to be. health officials in it -- health officials in britain say the country's covid-19 alert levels should move down from the highest level because hospitalizations have decreased. the coronavirus alert level was raised the highest last month when a third national lockdown was anoupsd amid skyrocketing cases and hospital admissions. but the spread of infection has slowed down partly because of britain's vaccination program. more than 18 million people in the u.k. have received at least one vaccine dose. israel is passing a major threshold as its rapid coronavirus vaccination drive leadwo